# Law and practice **URL:** https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/c/law-and-practice/5.md?page=7 [Latest](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/latest.md) · [Categories](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/categories.md) · [Tags](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/tags.md) **Page:** 8 --- ## [When does s3 detention of A&E patient commence?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/when-does-s3-detention-of-a-e-patient-commence/4495)
**Author:** [@Kemmasokol](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/Kemmasokol)\ **Replies:** 1\ **Last updated:** [19 October 2025 16:19 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/when-does-s3-detention-of-a-e-patient-commence/4495 "2025-10-19T16:19:31Z")
Patient was detained by police on 17/08/2025 and taken to A&E. An AMHP and two doctors assessed her on 19/08/2025 and signed the section 3 application on the same date. However, the H3 form states in Part A that the pati… --- ## [AMHPs and MHAAs](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/amhps-and-mhaas/4324)
**Author:** [@RS0](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/RS0)\ **Replies:** 5\ **Last updated:** [19 October 2025 15:32 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/amhps-and-mhaas/4324 "2025-10-19T15:32:51Z")
Dear all, A colleague is in a complexity where they have several EUPD patients on the female ward, who for various reasons are requiring a MHA assessment. There has been instances where the AMHPs have spoken to the pati… --- ## [Blocked from accessing advocacy - what can I do?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/blocked-from-accessing-advocacy-what-can-i-do/4450)
**Author:** [@MetaphorMuse](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/MetaphorMuse)\ **Replies:** 6\ **Last updated:** [18 October 2025 13:23 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/blocked-from-accessing-advocacy-what-can-i-do/4450 "2025-10-18T13:23:42Z")
I’m supporting someone who is under social care and S117 aftercare. Despite reported, clear requests, no-one will answer my question about how to access an independent advocate. I’ve asked directly and in writing, but I’… --- ## [Should there be Statute that limits detained patients' access to the internet?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/should-there-be-statute-that-limits-detained-patients-access-to-the-internet/4457)
**Author:** [@CaptainWalker](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/CaptainWalker)\ **Replies:** 1\ **Last updated:** [17 October 2025 16:18 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/should-there-be-statute-that-limits-detained-patients-access-to-the-internet/4457 "2025-10-17T16:18:08Z")
This issue is raised for consideration because I came across a situation where one forensic inpatient was found with video content via Facebook, of another inpatient in another city committing suicide. The psychological … --- ## [Is the Nearest Relative more powerful than a doctor?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/is-the-nearest-relative-more-powerful-than-a-doctor/3310)
**Author:** [@CaptainWalker](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/CaptainWalker)\ **Replies:** 16\ **Last updated:** [17 October 2025 10:46 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/is-the-nearest-relative-more-powerful-than-a-doctor/3310 "2025-10-17T10:46:01Z")
My understanding - subject to invited correction - is that an ‘application’ for admission to a hospital is more powerful than a ‘medical recommendation’. I can think that because across the land ‘medical recommendations’… --- ## [HELP! Transferred prisoner issues regarding 'pocket money'](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/help-transferred-prisoner-issues-regarding-pocket-money/4448)
**Author:** [@wendy2](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/wendy2)\ **Replies:** 5\ **Last updated:** [15 October 2025 17:25 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/help-transferred-prisoner-issues-regarding-pocket-money/4448 "2025-10-15T17:25:21Z")
I have represented a transferred prisoner for many years now, and as he isn’t entitled to any DWP benefits he gets the standard £20 per week. This has been no problem at all over the last 20 years but he has recently tra… --- ## [Dementia patient won’t stop driving](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/dementia-patient-won-t-stop-driving/3022)
**Author:** [@anonymous50](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/anonymous50)\ **Replies:** 8\ **Last updated:** [15 October 2025 16:29 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/dementia-patient-won-t-stop-driving/3022 "2025-10-15T16:29:02Z")
Hi A dementia patient over 75. Driving licence expired. Refuses to stop driving or go through additional driving course to have driving ability tested. DVLA and police aware of concerns. No family. Not engaging. Becomes… --- ## [Autism Act 2009 – commissioning duties and separation from LD services?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/autism-act-2009-commissioning-duties-and-separation-from-ld-services/4446)
**Author:** [@anonymous77](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/anonymous77)\ **Replies:** 0\ **Last updated:** [15 October 2025 14:25 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/autism-act-2009-commissioning-duties-and-separation-from-ld-services/4446 "2025-10-15T14:25:18Z")
The Autism Act 2009 was designed to ensure that autistic adults without a learning disability are recognized as a distinct group with specific needs. However, in practice, many services are still commissioned under the c… --- ## [When does s2 detention of existing inpatient commence?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/when-does-s2-detention-of-existing-inpatient-commence/4444)
**Author:** [@Kemmasokol](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/Kemmasokol)\ **Replies:** 1\ **Last updated:** [15 October 2025 13:43 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/when-does-s2-detention-of-existing-inpatient-commence/4444 "2025-10-15T13:43:09Z")
My client was detained under Section 2. The AMHP and the doctors all saw him on 01/08/2025 and signed the papers on the same day. However, the H3 form states that he was admitted to hospital on 26/07/2025, and it was sig… --- ## [Should lawyer check s3 papers for CTO client?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/should-lawyer-check-s3-papers-for-cto-client/4433)
**Author:** [@Kemmasokol](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/Kemmasokol)\ **Replies:** 5\ **Last updated:** [14 October 2025 22:59 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/should-lawyer-check-s3-papers-for-cto-client/4433 "2025-10-14T22:59:31Z")
My client is on a CTO. Is it enough to review the CTO papers, or do I also need to review the section 3 papers? --- ## [S117, Probation Licence, MAPPA, ICB Responsibility](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/s117-probation-licence-mappa-icb-responsibility/4426)
**Author:** [@Laura82](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/Laura82)\ **Replies:** 2\ **Last updated:** [12 October 2025 09:19 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/s117-probation-licence-mappa-icb-responsibility/4426 "2025-10-12T09:19:56Z")
Person entitled to S117 pre custody following detention under section 3 following a serious incident of self-harm in the community and remains entitled to S117 as not discharged from S117 prior to, or during custody. Cu… --- ## [When must RC-specific powers cease?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/when-must-rc-specific-powers-cease/4107)
**Author:** [@CaptainWalker](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/CaptainWalker)\ **Replies:** 23\ **Last updated:** [9 October 2025 21:07 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/when-must-rc-specific-powers-cease/4107 "2025-10-09T21:07:51Z")
The obvious answer is that with the departure of the RC or change of RC, the previous RC’s power ceases to exist. But what does this mean to me? It means until approved by the incoming RC: S17 leave will be void. T2s … --- ## [Section dates after CTO revocation](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/section-dates-after-cto-revocation/4412)
**Author:** [@Kemmasokol](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/Kemmasokol)\ **Replies:** 3\ **Last updated:** [8 October 2025 10:25 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/section-dates-after-cto-revocation/4412 "2025-10-08T10:25:06Z")
my client was detained under Section 3 on 1st of January 2025, on 5th of May he was discharged on CTO. October 3rd, the CTO was revoked. My question is, does date of Section 3 start on the original date, or does it sta… --- ## [Number of ECT treatments that can be specified under s62 pending SOAD T6 authorisation](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/number-of-ect-treatments-that-can-be-specified-under-s62-pending-soad-t6-authorisation/4410)
**Author:** [@anonymous34](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/anonymous34)\ **Replies:** 1\ **Last updated:** [7 October 2025 16:55 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/number-of-ect-treatments-that-can-be-specified-under-s62-pending-soad-t6-authorisation/4410 "2025-10-07T16:55:42Z")
Hello I know there is no statutory limit to the number of ECT treatments that can be authorised under T4 or T6 with the usual being 12, but what about ECT under s62? Some are saying only 2 ECT treatments can be specifie… --- ## [S48 - What does urgent mean?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/s48-what-does-urgent-mean/4366)
**Author:** [@CaptainWalker](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/CaptainWalker)\ **Replies:** 5\ **Last updated:** [7 October 2025 15:14 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/s48-what-does-urgent-mean/4366 "2025-10-07T15:14:33Z")
Yes - that is the question. 48.—(1) If in the case of a person to whom this section applies the Secretary of State is satisfied by the same reports as are required for the purposes of section 47 above that— \[(a)that p… --- ## [Transfer from notional s37 hospital order to s7 guardianship?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/transfer-from-notional-s37-hospital-order-to-s7-guardianship/4360)
**Author:** [@lizzyW](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/lizzyW)\ **Replies:** 2\ **Last updated:** [7 October 2025 07:21 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/transfer-from-notional-s37-hospital-order-to-s7-guardianship/4360 "2025-10-07T07:21:20Z")
Hi all i am aware that a detained individual can be transferred from hospital to the Guardianship of the LSSA. This has the effect of using the existing medical applications and recommendations to hospital as if they we… --- ## [Validity of first med rec if AMHP and Ind s12 dr discharge but then pt deteriorates further](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/validity-of-first-med-rec-if-amhp-and-ind-s12-dr-discharge-but-then-pt-deteriorates-further/4336)
**Author:** [@MESK](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/MESK)\ **Replies:** 2\ **Last updated:** [6 October 2025 12:47 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/validity-of-first-med-rec-if-amhp-and-ind-s12-dr-discharge-but-then-pt-deteriorates-further/4336 "2025-10-06T12:47:35Z")
Hello, Can I please ask for advice for a scenario which came up while on call as a section 12 doctor re validity of first medical recommendations under the MHA. A patient was assessed in A&E under the MHA and a first m… --- ## [Discharge from community mental health services after ethics committee meeting](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/discharge-from-community-mental-health-services-after-ethics-committee-meeting/4357)
**Author:** [@Daisy2019](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/Daisy2019)\ **Replies:** 0\ **Last updated:** [6 October 2025 12:47 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/discharge-from-community-mental-health-services-after-ethics-committee-meeting/4357 "2025-10-06T12:47:24Z")
Hi the SU with a diagnosis of EUPD has been discharged from community mental health services following a ethics committee meeting which the SU was told nothing about. And a universal care plan, which was told to the SU t… --- ## [Solicitor's attendance at s117 meeting for patient who lacks capacity](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/solicitors-attendance-at-s117-meeting-for-patient-who-lacks-capacity/4338)
**Author:** [@MetaphorMuse](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/MetaphorMuse)\ **Replies:** 1\ **Last updated:** [5 October 2025 13:55 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/solicitors-attendance-at-s117-meeting-for-patient-who-lacks-capacity/4338 "2025-10-05T13:55:17Z")
Where a person lacks capacity and is represented by a solicitor, should that solicitor be formally invited to attend the Section 117 aftercare meeting to ensure their legal rights and best interests are upheld? --- ## [Missing Hospital Managers Reviews](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/missing-hospital-managers-reviews/4297)
**Author:** [@AmyBooth](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/AmyBooth)\ **Replies:** 13\ **Last updated:** [2 October 2025 18:26 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/missing-hospital-managers-reviews/4297 "2025-10-02T18:26:44Z")
We have received legal advice that the absence of an Associate Hospital Managers Review within a period of detention would render the whole detention invalid, even if there have been subsequent renewals and hearings held… --- ## [Misrepresentation of Court Authority: Removal of Vulnerable Person Without Order](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/misrepresentation-of-court-authority-removal-of-vulnerable-person-without-order/4319)
**Author:** [@anonymous74](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/anonymous74)\ **Replies:** 2\ **Last updated:** [28 September 2025 07:15 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/misrepresentation-of-court-authority-removal-of-vulnerable-person-without-order/4319 "2025-09-28T07:15:58Z")
What actions should be taken when an individual asserts they have a court order authorising the removal of a vulnerable person from one placement to another, when in fact no such order exists—only that an application has… --- ## [Old editions of books for sale](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/old-editions-of-books-for-sale/4267)
**Author:** [@Jonathan](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/Jonathan)\ **Replies:** 4\ **Last updated:** [24 September 2025 10:06 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/old-editions-of-books-for-sale/4267 "2025-09-24T10:06:20Z")
I need to clear some space but would like these books to go to good homes. They are all books which have newer editions. If you would like any, feel free to reply below or email jonathan at mentalhealthlaw.co.uk with an … --- ## [CTO in Scotland](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/cto-in-scotland/4292)
**Author:** [@hewitt](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/hewitt)\ **Replies:** 6\ **Last updated:** [24 September 2025 07:59 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/cto-in-scotland/4292 "2025-09-24T07:59:37Z")
If a patient in Scotland on a CTO wants to be trasnferred to England, is the procedure the same the authority of CTO is swapped over by a CTO10 He is also under a Guardianship order with the office of public guardisn (S… --- ## [How would I go about finding a Court of Protection case without a case number...?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/how-would-i-go-about-finding-a-court-of-protection-case-without-a-case-number/4295)
**Author:** [@Gaia](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/Gaia)\ **Replies:** 5\ **Last updated:** [24 September 2025 06:37 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/how-would-i-go-about-finding-a-court-of-protection-case-without-a-case-number/4295 "2025-09-24T06:37:41Z")
I am trying to find the details of an ongoing CoP case; I know the period in which the case was initially heard, but I have looked at the cases on the BAILII database within that time period, and I can’t find it - am I s… --- ## [What happens if a nearest relative requests to discharge a patient on S3 but there has been no response?](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/what-happens-if-a-nearest-relative-requests-to-discharge-a-patient-on-s3-but-there-has-been-no-response/4248)
**Author:** [@Christoph](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/Christoph)\ **Replies:** 10\ **Last updated:** [23 September 2025 15:51 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/what-happens-if-a-nearest-relative-requests-to-discharge-a-patient-on-s3-but-there-has-been-no-response/4248 "2025-09-23T15:51:21Z")
Him I would like to ask what would be the outcome to the following: Nearest relative has requested to discharge a patient on section 3, yet there has not been a response or formal confirmation of this being allowed or … --- ## [CTO and Section 3 (renewal dates)](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/cto-and-section-3-renewal-dates/4283)
**Author:** [@ECl](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/ECl)\ **Replies:** 2\ **Last updated:** [23 September 2025 15:48 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/cto-and-section-3-renewal-dates/4283 "2025-09-23T15:48:34Z")
Hello, I wonder if anyone can help… When a patient is on a CTO and is in and out of hospital settings how do the dates with the Section3 work out? EG, If a S3 began in January and the person goes back to the community… --- ## [Help finding a case - R v Callaghan (Calocane)](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/help-finding-a-case-r-v-callaghan-calocane/4288)
**Author:** [@Joolsleeds](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/Joolsleeds)\ **Replies:** 2\ **Last updated:** [21 September 2025 11:54 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/help-finding-a-case-r-v-callaghan-calocane/4288 "2025-09-21T11:54:36Z")
I’ve just seen this in some recent sentencing remarks in a diminished responsibility case: "I turn to the various options in terms of sentencing. Those are: Imprisonment; a Mental Health Act order under s.37 with or wit… --- ## [Homelessness and S117 - can OR change during a s2 admission before a s3 for the purpose of s117](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/homelessness-and-s117-can-or-change-during-a-s2-admission-before-a-s3-for-the-purpose-of-s117/4274)
**Author:** [@B.G](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/B.G)\ **Replies:** 4\ **Last updated:** [17 September 2025 15:32 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/homelessness-and-s117-can-or-change-during-a-s2-admission-before-a-s3-for-the-purpose-of-s117/4274 "2025-09-17T15:32:15Z")
Dear Colleagues, I understand ‘qualifying detention’ to be sections that give rise to s117 aftercare, however for the purpose of applying the Worcestershire judgement when working out aftercare, does the ‘immediately be… --- ## [Nottingham Inquiry report](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/nottingham-inquiry-report/3227)
**Author:** [@Joolsleeds](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/Joolsleeds)\ **Replies:** 9\ **Last updated:** [17 September 2025 09:34 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/nottingham-inquiry-report/3227 "2025-09-17T09:34:30Z")
As you may have seen in the news the full version of the NHS Nottingham Inquiry report has been published: What is unusual and striking is how the report investigates how senior Trust quality and monitoring systems - … --- ## [Co-detention: Unfit 37/41 and 3](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/co-detention-unfit-37-41-and-3/4265)
**Author:** [@SYorkForensicPsych](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/u/SYorkForensicPsych)\ **Replies:** 1\ **Last updated:** [16 September 2025 12:47 UTC](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/t/co-detention-unfit-37-41-and-3/4265 "2025-09-16T12:47:10Z")
Hiya. Does anyone have experience, or know of any case law that references, co-detaining a patient on an unfit 37/41 and a 3? I know there is precident for s3 and s35 (R v North West London MH Trust Ex p. Stewart (1997)… [Previous page](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/c/law-and-practice/5.md?page=6) [Next page](https://forum.mentalhealthlaw.co.uk/c/law-and-practice/5.md?page=8)